Valerie and Helen have been profoundly empowered by their volunteer experience, and volunteering has expanded their recovery. Storytelling has been the fundamental aspect of their volunteer work over ten years. Join them for this episode as they share how both telling and hearing the story of fighting the battles with mental health gives inspiration, practical advice, connection, and most important, hope for recovery.
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Empowerment and Recovery through Volunteering and Storytelling
Episode 28
Helen Sneed: Welcome to Mental Health, Hope and Recovery. I'm Helen Sneed.
Valerie Milburn: And I'm Valerie Milburn.
Helen Sneed: We both have fought and overcome severe chronic mental illnesses. Our podcast offers a unique approach to mental health conditions. We use practical skills and inspirational true stories of recovery. Our knowledge is up close and personal.
Valerie Milburn: Helen and I are your peers. We're not doctors, therapists or social workers. We're not professionals, but we are experts. We are experts in our own lived experience with multiple mental health diagnoses and symptoms. Please join us on our journey.
Helen Sneed: We live in recovery. So can you.
Valerie Milburn: This podcast does not provide medical advice. The information presented is not intended to be a substitute for or relied upon as medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. The podcast is for informational purposes only. Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health providers with any health related questions you may have.
Helen Sneed: Welcome to episode 28, Empowerment and Recovery Through Storytelling and Volunteering. Periodically we stop to assess the progressive paths in our lives in recovery and to take note of any changes. Well, at times, moments of great insight can strike without warning. One of these moments hit Valerie and me recently. We realized that years of volunteer work have strengthened us in ways we've never understood before. It hit like a ton of bricks. Valerie and I could suddenly recognize that storytelling and volunteering have profoundly empowered us and expanded our recovery. They have had a leading role in the women we are today.
Valerie Milburn: Indeed.
Helen Sneed: Now to begin, storytelling has been the fundamental aspect of our volunteer work over 10 years. It's where we started as we know every culture needs and has its stories. Hearing the story of another person fighting the same battles with mental health gives me inspiration, practical advice, connection and most important, hope for recovery. Often I'd listen to another person's story and think, oh, she does that too. I thought I was the only one. So I'm not alone. As Lena Waithe said, I'm telling my story so that others might see fragments of themselves. Roger Bingham put it this way. We tell stories in order to feel at home in the universe. And an old Native American proverb says, those who tell the stories rule the world. Well, telling the story of your personal mental health battle is a tall order. At least it was for me. Especially the first time the late Perry Hoffman, a pioneer in Borderline Personality Disorder, invited me to speak to the National Education Alliance Borderline Personality Disorder, a national conference at a big auditorium at Mount Sinai Hospital in New York City. The audience was 150 doctors and therapists. Oh my. As I spoke, the shock of telling my story was so great I dissociated and watched myself from the ceiling. I spoke too long and too fast and was riddled with self doubt and shame when it was over. But the second time was
Helen Sneed: different. I was asked to tell my story to the top staff of the National Institute of Mental health outside Washington, D.C. i was well rehearsed and ready. When I finished, Dr. Tom Insel, head of NIMH, looked at me and asked helen, would you come back? Well, I said I'd be delighted to. Dr. Insel said he had doctors and researchers who needed to hear my story about recovery from Borderline Personality Disorder. Well, we did go back and our second presentation was truly stellar. I shared the stage with Marsha Linehan, the creator of dialectical behavior therapy DBT, and my other heroine, Dr. Perry Hoffman. Well, the impact of our presentation was stunning. In his weekly blog, Dr. Insel wrote that we had changed his outlook on BPD and he was more optimistic about research, treatment and recovery from his much maligned illness. Now, at the personal level, the storytelling was nothing short of miraculous. I felt like my former healthy self for the first time. The very first time in many years. I had been capable of using some of my old abilities to affect positive change and taking the risk to tell my story before large audiences and succeeding were some of the most powerful turning points in my road to recovery.
Valerie Milburn: Wow. It's no wonder your first storytelling experiences were so powerful. I mean, they were so prestigious. You, you really started off with the bang. Helen.
Helen Sneed: I was going to say starting off at the top, you know.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, well, I didn't see it that.
Helen Sneed: Way at the time, but I guess it was.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, it really was prestigious. And my first volunteer experience in recovery was When I was five years sober, I was in a really weird state of mind at that point. I. I don't why, except I seemed to have lost my compass at that point. I'd lost my serenity, my connection, my gratitude. A friend of mine was the volunteer coordinator for Communities for Recovery, a nonprofit here in Austin serving those who live with substance use disorder and mental health disorders. And my friend said to me, you need to get out of yourself. Yeah, I needed to hear that.
Helen Sneed: So the feeling.
Valerie Milburn: I began volunteering for Communities for Recovery. I was leading small recovery meetings at an Austin psychiatric hospital, and I had been a patient in that hospital twice before I got sober. And volunteering there reminded me of how far I had come. I remember thinking every time I left that hospital, thank you, God, for a badge and a key. And, you know, while I was leading those groups, I discovered that by sharing the gifts of my five years of recovery with those who were currently in crisis in that psychiatric hospital, I could give. Could give others hope. I could share how I had climbed out of my own mental health crisis. I could share my own truths, my own triumphs. For example, I shared once that one of my first triumphs was the ability to join my family again for dinner consistently. And others in that group could connect with this as an attainable goal. I mean, we were talking the same language, sharing the same pain, connecting through hope. And you know what? My gratitude returned and a sense of purpose returned was formed in some ways for the first time now. I had shared about my alcoholism and addiction with many, many people and about my mental health struggles with some. And I had sponsored a few women in recovery at that point, but always one on one. Now I was sharing with small groups of my peers, but I was ready to share my mental health journey with a wider audience. I knew I had a story of hope and recovery that could help others. And one definition of stigma is shame and silence. And I didn't want to be silent anymore. I wanted to help break down the stigma that surrounds mental health in our society. Well, the universe aligned, and I got involved with the national alliance on Mental Illness, Central Texas. NAMI gave me the training, the skills, and the opportunities to share my story with that wider audience. I was looking for. And I met you, Helen.
Helen Sneed: It was. It was my lucky day. Valerie. Frankly, one of the luckiest I've ever had. Because, you know, the two of us met at ANAMI training program, and I had just moved back to Austin after 40 years in New York City, and I was miserable. I felt lost and bewildered and Just completely untethered and unconnected to the world. So I think little could either one of us
Helen Sneed: us have imagined the impact the organization or our friendship would have on the trajectory of our journey. And where we have landed today, I certainly couldn't have foreseen any of this.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, absolutely.
Helen Sneed: Yeah. So there we were, two women with two stories. And now we'd like to tell you what we were able to build from this simple beginning. How we were inspired and empowered by so many different kinds of service through volunteering. I had just finished training for NAMI's program called In Our Own Voice. Two trained volunteers go out into the community to present by telling their own stories and using a video also focused on recovery. We are encouraged to give an unvarnished story that describes our darkest hours unflinchingly well. I had done a lot of public speaking on other topics, but I really thought the story of my battle with mental illness was grim and depressing and, frankly, just not worth telling. I mean, I was concerned about my material, and I was really ashamed of revealing various elements of those terrible years. But early on, after I finished an In Our Own Voice presentation, an amazing thing happened. A woman from the audience approached me. She was crying. I asked her if I could help, and she looked at me and said, you already have. You've given me more hope than I felt in years. I will never forget her or that moment, for it had a profound impact on my recovery down to my very identity. And as I look back, it's so clear now that telling my story and believing in its worth gave me the first sense of self respect I had felt in many years. Now, Valerie, you and I have told our story scores of times through volunteering. And to begin with, we have traveled to so many different kinds of places over the years. I mean, all over Central Texas and beyond. And I love it and always learn something new from the audience responses. I mean, we have talked to all kinds of people in organizations, schools, churches and synagogues, job training programs, women's clubs, a state conference of Texas judges, faculty and students at Dell Medical School, the University of Texas School of Nursing, Texas legislators and sorority girls or women.
Valerie Milburn: We really have been all over the place, haven't we? I've done a tremendous number of presentations in middle and high schools for the NAMI program called Ending the Silence. I've spent scores of hours speaking to law enforcement, crisis intervention training groups. And you know, Helen, we did something during the pandemic that was really important. We trained, virtually trained hundreds of 911 operators, and I spoke to psychiatrists and therapists at the University of Texas Health Student Health center and we've presented, I think you mentioned to many different faith based groups.
Helen Sneed: Now we'd like to give specific examples of how instructive and meaningful our storytelling has been. I would say it's been a real major part of our learning curve, to say the least. I gave dozens of presentations in the locked psych unit of a major Austin hospital. At first it was very triggering to hear the jangling keys of the staff and the smells and sounds of a mental hospital. My first presentations were really difficult.
Helen Sneed: There were usually about 12 to 15 patients in all states of illness, dress and medication, so a part of me felt like I'd come home. I believed it was very important to be there. When I had been in hospitals, no one ever appeared who had actually recovered, so I went there as often as I could and sometimes by myself if no other presenters could be found. At one point, going back into the hospital became so difficult that I almost quit. It just reminded me too much of the past and that will kill me if I let it. I told no one and was able to use my own DBT skills to overcome the intense negative feelings and this gave me a real sense of pride in my self sufficiency and I dug in with strong conviction. It was November. The holidays are especially difficult in a mental hospital. I remembered what it was like to be locked up, lonely, sick and with no hope and the hospital staff told me the patients frequently talked about our presentations for days afterwards. How could I not go?
Valerie Milburn: Really? People did talk about your presentations because I have a dear friend who was a patient in that psychiatric hospital for one of your presentations. She told me that hearing your story was the most powerful thing she heard the entire week she was there.
Helen Sneed: Oh, that. That just means everything to me. Thank you, Valerie. It means a lot.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah.
Helen Sneed: You know, you have made such an impact with so many groups, but I think I'm especially impressed with your contributions to law enforcement because I can't think of any other place or organization where understanding of the mentally ill is. Is so important. And, you know, I've seen you in action and have learned so much. So tell us about it.
Valerie Milburn: Well, thanks. I. That's probably the most powerful group I present to. It's so important that I do that. And because, you know, one of the biggest rewards of my recovery has been letting go of the shame I carried alongside having a mental health condition and my past behaviors associated with that. And my law enforcement interactions had lots of shame associated with them. Letting go of that shame was a long process. Prayer, the 12 steps, therapy, mindfulness, and journaling helped replace that shame with gratitude. Yes, gratitude. Gratitude both for making it to the other side and for the ability to help others through the same struggles I had conquered. As I began telling my story to groups outside the recovery community, like law enforcement, through volunteer opportunities, I began to shed the stigma of mental health conditions, because stigma is just another type of shame. It really is.
Valerie Milburn: It.
Valerie Milburn: It is.
Helen Sneed: It stops you dead in your tracks.
Valerie Milburn: It does. And. And telling my story as part of NAMI's presentation for law Enforcement's crisis intervention training has had an in tremendous impact on me and on the officers. The officers have told me more times than I can count how meaningful it is to them to hear a story of someone living in recovery with a mental health condition. Because they don't see people in recovery in their interactions, they see people in crisis. Seeing my recovery helps these officers see the person, not the disease. I tell them, as I share my law enforcement interactions, that those officers were seeing me on my very worst days, and I am more than those very bad days. I tell them how helpful the officers were to me during my crisis and what those officers did that was helpful. This knowledge benefits the officers in their future interactions with people in a mental health crisis. And this volunteer work with law enforcement has given me a new perspective on those dark days. I now know that my experiences have meaning and value to these officers. And that I can be of service because of my experiences and not live in shame because of them.
Helen Sneed: Well, it's a, it's a remarkable contribution that you make. And so frequently now we want to look at another enriching type of volunteering, and that was teaching and training others who were fighting mental illness. One of NAMI's most intensive and enlightening programs is peer to peer class. There were usually about 15 students in the class, although there was a drop off rate. Two trained volunteers taught skills and methods for living to people trying to overcome mental illness and move towards
Helen Sneed: recovery. The curriculum included goal setting, healthy relationships, self care, many skills to help overcome symptoms and suicidal ideation, and methods to support the fight for recovery. I learned so much. I use many of these skills to this very day. The students were an inspiration, a challenge, and sometimes a mystery, but we stuck it out together. I think one of the most cherished aspects of Peer to peer was the companionship to be in the room with people with similar experiences, people who get it. Most class members admitted to loneliness. For a number of students, the class was the one time they left their house during the week. I learned and practiced patience, compassion and resourcefulness in ways I never had before. It was instrumental in teaching me that I might become a leader again, that I was worthy enough to be a role model to at least some of the people I taught. And one of the greatest outcomes was the number of our students who graduated and went on to volunteer for NAMI programs themselves.
Valerie Milburn: I know, I love that about the people who come to class wanting to then go on to lead a class. And you know, you just mentioned patience and compassion. And I practiced extending patience and compassion to myself through teaching peer to peer classes. An example of that was a really challenging class one night where there was a lot of discussion about suicide and self harm and it just left me emotionally exhausted and a bit triggered by my own past trauma. And we were trained, our training was really great. We were trained to contact our NAMI program manager in just such instances where if we were really impacted by what we heard in class and she helped me with self care and reminded me of the strategies and skills I use in my recovery.
Helen Sneed: Well, I think again that's, it's really important for you to bring this up because you know, we, we love doing all this, but we're not perfect, you know, and some of the time, you know, you just need to get some help and you did when you, you saw it coming and you took care of yourself, right?
Valerie Milburn: I mean, sharing, you know, storytelling in front of these audiences or in front of any audience is. Brings up a lot. It really does. And one of the things they. We've been taught in preparing for storytelling is to protect ourselves by sharing, you know, afterwards, talking to someone we trust, usually, Helen, you and I debrief and, you know, we'll talk about any feelings that come up as we share our past. Like you said, these are things we often thought we would never tell in public. And, you know, we now know that it's. We help so many people, we want to do it, and we get so much back. I mean, yesterday I presented to law enforcement cadets, and after the presentation, one of the cadets came up to me with tears in his eyes. And, I mean, that's pretty hard to do in a room full of police cadets to come up, right? I mean, I'm sure he was really struggling if he let some tears show. And he talked to me about everything he had gotten just from hearing my story yesterday. And we had a wonderful conversation. And when we finished, I said, you know, you really made my day, my week. And he said, no, you made my day. And it was just a lovely exchange. But it's a lot of vulnerability to be out there and do it, but so rewarding.
Helen Sneed: You're just giving a great example of why it's so worthwhile.
Valerie Milburn: It really is. So. So that's a lot about what we learned teaching and a lot about what we learned storytelling. But so the other part of teaching came along with that was training. And I'm a nationally trained state trainer, so I'm a trained person to train others. And as a former teacher, I thought training would be, you know, pretty easy because training is teaching. But I had to overcome my fears of being vulnerable about my mental health to actually train others to overcome their vulnerabilities, to teach about mental health. And I was able to do that. And one really interesting thing was that we did mock training in front of the national trainers as part of our training. Kind of hard to follow, but so I was up there training in front of all of these people watching me. And it was really wonderful because it reminded me of how I had successfully presented my work in front of legislative committees when I was in my late 20s, before my mental health condition changed the course of my life. And, Helen, as you said earlier, it's in moments like these that I'm strengthened
Valerie Milburn: by connecting with my core, former healthy self. And there's a beautiful poem that describes this for me, and it's by Sulika Jaoud. And here's the Poem. I have walked through many lives, some of them my own, and I am not who I was. Though some principle of being abides from.
Valerie Milburn: Which I struggle not to stray.
Helen Sneed: That's beautiful.
Valerie Milburn: Yep. That's how we.
Valerie Milburn: So true.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah. And lots of examples of that for us. So now I train people to become class leaders, and it's rewarding that I have trained throughout Central Texas and sent these new leaders out into their communities to now lead these classes.
Helen Sneed: Now, Valerie, don't forget public relations. Now, I have done a lot of press in my time, but, Valerie, you are something of a rock star in Central Texas.
Valerie Milburn: Well, thank you, but it's just as close as I'll ever get to being a rock star. Makes me think about what would happen if you ask my family about my terrible singing voice. They'll tell you I'll never be a rock star. But let me tell you, I'd love to tell you about my first media event when I spoke. The first time I spoke with the media about my mental health condition. The first time was a television interview for five news stations. There were five reporters, five cameras. I mean, wow. I had never before said on television, I. I live in recovery with bipolar disorder. And it was for this massive number of cameras at once. I was being interviewed at the groundbreaking for a new mental health crisis center, discussing the importance of the center to our community. And I felt empowered, I felt free, I felt proud, I felt grateful. Thinking about gratitude, Helen, is a great time to talk about the volunteer opportunity that came along early in the pandemic, because without that project we did together, I might have stayed in that deep depression the pandemic brought for me for an even longer period of h***.
Helen Sneed: Yeah, it was a dangerous time, I think for me. The abrupt and really dramatic deprivations and a lot of fear of the pandemic threatened my mental health drastically. And, you know, as I struggle not to slip back during the pandemic, Valerie, you pulled me into this all encompassing project for nami. And this was just after all of our live presentations and teaching had been canceled overnight. I mean, it was like an amputation, you know?
Valerie Milburn: Yeah.
Helen Sneed: And so the work was quite a challenge. We wanted to reach the people stuck at home and needing support. So we designed and built a new program that converted in person programs into a virtual format via Zoom.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, we did, and it was challenging. But you know what? That situation was a godsend. And the best part, we reached and helped people who were trapped in isolation while we helped ourselves.
Helen Sneed: Yeah, it was, it was. It was quite an experience. And for me, I think a lifesaver. But I guess I want to say to our listeners that now you have journeyed with us through the profound transformative challenges and impact of volunteering. I hope that we've made at least some of it clear to you. For me, the work, community and friendships have endowed my life with a richness and fulfillment I have never known before. And through volunteering, I have really grown. I've gained patience, resilience, doggedness, self esteem, courage. I rebounded through action with skills, humor, staying in the moment and keeping myself open to the new things my life discovers. My sense of self has been strengthened, and I don't really know how to say it, I feel bolder and confident enough to take on any new opportunities that come my way. It's hard to describe how much more personal power I have developed without knowing it. You know, I mean, I don't even think I knew what personal power was before. So this has been just an invaluable time for me.
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, you said that really well. Yeah, made it very clear. You know, I. The community and friendships that come with volunteering have actually have absolutely been what. What you said. For me, they've been an unexpected joy. And for example, Communities for Recovery is as it name it, the
Valerie Milburn: name says a community, but for me, it's been more like family for 16 years. I love and support Communities for Recovery, and I have friends and sober sisters I met there whom I plan to nurture lifelong. And from my NAMI volunteering, I have deep friendships as well. And one of them, our listeners, know Eileen as she's been our brilliant guest for two episodes. And Eileen has become my dear friend through our volunteering. My other dear friend through NAMI is a loyal listener and she knows who she is. And both of them are both my friend and my teacher, and I hold them dear in my heart. And then there's you, Helen.
Helen Sneed: Well, you know, Valerie, as I look back, I really can't imagine the past years without you. You have given me so much in so many aspects of my life. You know, in some ways, I feel like we've grown up together and you have given me something I never thought I would have again. You have helped me to thrive.
Valerie Milburn: Oh, it's so sweet. Thank you. Well, we thrive together. Man, I can't believe you made me cry.
Helen Sneed: It's good news, Valerie. It's good news.
Valerie Milburn: I know it's good. Tears. That's how much you mean to me, Helen. So a minute ago you mentioned that volunteering made you confident enough to Take on a new opportunity. Well, boy, did a new opportunity come our way. And we are so fortunate that in late 2020, Helen, you were asked to start a mental health podcast. And I'm so honored that you answered that by saying you wouldn't do it without your friend Valerie.
Helen Sneed: I'm not stupid.
Valerie Milburn: No, and neither one of us. You know, we had never even thought about being podcasters, but as we considered the idea, we realized that we could do it. You know, our volunteer work had offered us the opportunity to help so many people, and podcasting would give us the opportunity to reach a vastly wider audience. So the two of us worked for months learning about podcasting and developing our topics. We launched our first episode in February of 2021, and now we've begun our third year. We have a large number of loyal listeners and our audiences worldwide. Helen, we've been successful beyond our expectations. Well, no, that's not really true, because we didn't have. We didn't have any expectations. We didn't know what to expect. But I can say something that is true. This podcast brings us joy and fulfillment.
Helen Sneed: Yes, it does.
Valerie Milburn: Really does. Now, feedback from our audiences over our years and years of presenting together had reinforced our confidence in the power of storytelling.
Helen Sneed: And.
Valerie Milburn: And that led to storytelling being the foundation of this podcast. And that feedback from our audiences over the years also informed our objectives and the variety of topics we pursue. So we have three objectives, three major objectives for this podcast. And the first one, teaching about different mental health conditions, is focused on in episodes such as post traumatic stress disorder and bipolar disorder. The second one, providing strategies and skills for those living with the mental health condition and for those who love and care for them, is interwoven throughout every episode. And the third objective, focusing on relationships, is so important that we did a four part series on relationships. Now, since the name of our podcast is Mental Health, Hope and Recovery, you probably already know that sharing our hope is our overall objective. We want you, our listeners, to know that it is possible to live in recovery with a mental health condition.
Helen Sneed: We always ask our guests what gives them hope when thinking about mental health and their work and those who live with mental health conditions. Dr. Cherise Simpson gave this answer when we asked her what gave her hope. She said, your podcast gives me hope. It's so important to keep talking about mental health. And Dr. Stephen Strakowski said this. The fact that we can have public conversations with people with an illness is what gives me hope. This podcast would not have happened
Helen Sneed: 30 years ago, and we start hearing public officials talking about the importance of mental health. And this, to me, is what makes me most hopeful. But I like the way one listener put it. She said, thank you for the timely reminder that every day there is hope, there is healing, there is life.
Valerie Milburn: I know. I love that one.
Helen Sneed: It's beautiful. And you know, our hope is expressed in every episode in the following words, we live in recovery. So can you. And now Valerie will take us through a mindfulness exercise.
Valerie Milburn: Absolutely, yes. We will close with our traditional mindfulness exercise. What is mindfulness? I always give a definition. Mindfulness is a mental state achieved by focusing one's awareness on the present moment while calmly acknowledging and accepting one's feelings, thoughts, and bodily sensations without judgment. Today's practice is about mindful speech. Humans are social creatures and, you know, rarely does a day go by where we don't interact with anyone. When we interact with others, we can bring mindfulness to what we are saying, how it impacts others, and what our intentions are. That's what we're going to focus on today, mindfully speaking with others. We will begin, as always, with our diaphragmatic deep breathing. Now, if you're driving or walking, please adapt this mindfulness exercise in such a way that it works in your current surroundings. Let's get mindful. If you can find a comfortable seated.
Valerie Milburn: Position, try closing your eyes, if it's safe to do so. Inhale through your nose, expanding an imaginary balloon in your stomach. Hold your breath. Exhale through your mouth, pulling your stomach in as you do so. Take another inhale. Expand that imaginary balloon. Hold your breath. Exhale through your mouth, pulling your stomach in. Drop your shoulders. Pull your stomach all the way in. One more time. Inhale through your nose. Expand your stomach. Hold your breath. Exhale through your mouth. Pull your stomach all the way in. Exhale completely. Continue with this deep, regular breathing. Visualize an upcoming conversation, maybe one that might be a bit difficult. Or maybe visualize a recurring situation where the interchange doesn't always go well. Or maybe a conversation you had recently that you wish had gone better. Now, visualize that that conversation is about to begin or begin again for the first time. Before you speak, bring mindfulness to your intentions. Ask yourself why you're going to say whatever you plan on saying. Examine the possibility of saying it with even more kindness or patience. Think about whether or not this is the appropriate time to talk. What purpose will your words serve? If it's possible that your words will put somebody else down, interrupt a person currently speaking, or ring as untrue, try reconsidering your choice of words while talking, speak slowly and be mindful of the words you are using. When
Valerie Milburn: someone responds either verbally or with body language, observe how it feels. Remember that you cannot control others, but you can bring mindfulness to your own responses. When you are done talking, leave the words be. Don't talk just to fill an uncomfortable silence. Listen to the other person and wait for the right time to talk again. If your eyes are closed, please open them and gently bring yourself back to the room. As you practice mindful speech more regularly.
Valerie Milburn: You will be able to navigate challenging conversations with more ease. Thank you for doing this mindfulness exercise with me.
Helen Sneed: Well, thank you Valerie, for taking us into tranquility as we bring our episode to a close. We want to thank you, our listeners, for your time, your intelligence, your interest. Mental Health, Hope and Recovery is the culmination of our work and our mission, and we are honored that you join us now. We could really use your help in reaching as many people as possible, which of course is our goal, and in reading your insights and responses to our episodes. So here are the ways you can support us. Number one, give feedback by emailing us at mental healthhopeandrecoverymail.com number two share the podcast on social media three email a link to a friend and four leave a review where you get your podcast as you can imagine, all of these things will help us tremendously. Valerie and I hope we've demonstrated the remarkable empowerment and healing that comes through storytelling and volunteering. What we've learned over the years is that we're all part of a larger story that just keeps unfolding as so many individuals fight mental health challenges as best they can with such resounding courage and tenacity and spirit that it has made me weep at times. Some of the strongest people in the world live with a mental health condition, and it's an inspiration and privilege to know them and to be of service for Valerie and me. These are our peers. We are all striving to achieve and maintain a life in recovery. Marshall Linehan once said, it's hard to be happy without a life worth living. What is important is that you experience your life as worth living, one that's satisfying and one that brings happiness. And now I leave you with the most empowering words I know about recovery. Dr. Blaise Aguirre said, the person can recover if they can see their own greatness, that they are as essential to the universe as anyone else. Our next episode stars Karen Casey, whose classic each a new daily Meditations for Women has sold over 4 million copies. Karen is familiar to generations of women in the recovery community and beyond. Together, we'll celebrate the 40th anniversary edition of her book and the release of a new one. This will be a rare opportunity to have an in depth discussion about mental health with a legend in the field. Please don't miss Karen Casey. And now I leave you with our favorite word. Onward.